Sequoia Family Crawler

[4xFoorOffroad]

I have never seen lock washers used in my professional aerospace career, nor in heavy machinery and automotive maintenance.

I have a quick question about this when all my 98 Taco aftermarket suspension parts come with Nylock or stover nuts. Like a lot of people I’ve swapped them out for standard hardware while mocking up stuff. They’re all 1/2, 9/16, 5/8, and 3/4 bolts for my suspension. Curious what opinions are out there on fine vs coarse thread when both are available on sizes like 1/2 and 9/16 and lock nut vs standard hex yellow zinc coated grade 8. I’d like to standardize all my hardware per size.

Not building a dedicated off road rig, just a point A to B prelander sort of rig. I’m considering keeping the lock nuts on the upper and lower uniballs and lower pivots since I already have them and they match the threads for my 5/8 / 3/4 coarse thread bolts, but for stuff like shocks and upper arm pivots is it necessary?

 

[Motiracer38]

There's a lot of opinions when it comes to hardware but here is mine:

Fine vs. coarse has a three part answer.
-Fine thread has a larger minor diameter, which is the diameter of the bottom of the threads, which leads to a stronger bolt.
-Fine thread allows for a higher torque which leads to a higher clamp pressure. Clamp pressure keeps your shocks or hiems in place without wiggling around, scratching off finishes and allowing rust to start.
-Fine thread takes more turns for a nut to loosen and back off so it's a higher chance to catch them during your next prep.

Stover nuts do hold better to vibration as well as heat but they cut into the threads as they lock and you really should replace the bolt every time you remove one. Nylon insert nuts have also held for me as long as you do replace every time you loosen. Bolts are $5 each, nuts are $0.40 each so it's more likely I complete a prep if it's cheaper.

Grade 8 are the way to go always. The yellow zinc is a harder coating than zinc which holds up to scrapes better. Grade 8 torque values are higher leading to higher clamp pressure and I've only ever had problems with grade 8 rounding off or stripping. F9 bolts are stronger but likely unnecessary for trucks. Maybe for arms and link bolts but they are more suspectable to hydrogen embrittlement during heat treating which makes them less more likely to break on impact versus bending.

Always use washers as they distribute the bolt load better but also keep the tabs from damage when the nut is tightened. I like SAE washers as they are about as big as an impact socket.and keep your tab paint fresh. AN washers are smaller still and used when your weld bead is too close. Grade 8 lead to more consistent torque values as they are harder but I like the softer grade 5 as they conform a bit as well as have some squish to them that may hold nuts on better. I once had a bolt that would never stay tight until I swapped to grade 5 washers.

Above all, make sure you have sleeves and misalignment spacers that can take the clamp force. I've collapsed both and it's infuriating.

 

[84projectFORD]

Above all, make sure you have sleeves and misalignment spacers that can take the clamp force. I've collapsed both and it's infuriating.

Had ruff stuff ones do that on me. No fun…

 

[85Yota]

It seems that stainless misalignment spacers all like to do that because there is a small gap between them so they tighten against the lip hitting the ball. This will let the lip deflect OR the narrow part of taper will squeeze into the bolt. I've noticed this happens much more often, aka only time i've had it happen, when the threads of the bolt are in this part of the spacer so the spacer will deform into the thread making it so you can't remove the bolt. When I shank the bolts I've never had this happen.

 

[Motiracer38]

You make a great point.

Shanking is when you have the smooth, fullsize part of the bolt running from under the bolt head all the way through the opposite tab so that no threads touch the tabs. The threaded portion is a bit smaller and can rattle around in the hole beating the tab up as well as the sharp threads cutting into it. Grade 8 bolts do not have a consistent shank length between manufacturers so it gets frustrating buying in 1/4" increments. Thick weld washers help give some more allowance on length. Cut the rest of the threads leaving 3-4 and add paint to the raw end for style points.

Also forgot to mention to add torque stripe from the bolt threads over the nut to the tab so that a quick visual prep is possible while waiting for the tri tip to finish up.

 

[85Yota]

You can be a real baller and get gold paint pen for the ends to match the grade 8 gold plating. Also comes with silver for your cheap zinc bolts or black oxide bolts you want to look fancy and not rust

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sharpie...pfUquK9DhurEUkxAVFoaApUfEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

[GahnRacing]

I’m lost.. are you building a Sequoia here?..

 

[85Yota]

Yes sequoia build, but he's an engineer that's very smart and shares his knowledge for all us lesser people learn from him

 

[Motiracer38]

I am slowly building a Sequoia, got a bunch of half finished tasks so far so no real picture update.

Forums are great for technical discussions open for rebuttal so I figured I'd expand when requested. Link geometry is almost set so that will be a fun post. Still learning how to build a rock crawler, it's quite a bit more complicated than a desert truck with the front driveline and all.

 

[Motiracer38]

I've been working on this non stop with very little to show. Front axle is in place and steering is almost finished. Trimmed to fit 40s at bump but need to see what flex trimming is going to require.

 

[85Yota]

Will need at least 4" more clearance on front and rear to clear with articulation

 

[TTBDORA]

I've been working on this non stop with very little to show. Front axle is in place and steering is almost finished. Trimmed to fit 40s at bump but need to see what flex trimming is going to require.
View attachment 28029

To me this REALLY gives you an idea of how massive the 40s are. Friggen beefy!

 

[Motiracer38]

I was actually surprised how well they fit into the body. The firewall is untouched and so far the corner light is safe. If it weren't for the excessive steering angle causing the frame rework it wouldn't have been that hard to fit. Can't wait to roll it out and see how comical they look.

 

[85Yota]

Can't wait to roll it out and see how comical they look.

You mean can't wait to see how awesome they look

 

[Oh4Tahoe]

I've been working on this non stop with very little to show. Front axle is in place and steering is almost finished. Trimmed to fit 40s at bump but need to see what flex trimming is going to require.
View attachment 28029

, I have dreams of 40s and a relatively low-slung height on my Tahoe. Can’t wait to see your progress!

 

[Motiracer38]

I got the steering just about finished up. Toyota box to sheetmetal hi steer through a dual ended ram assist cylinder. The goal is equal steering force and increased strength over one long tie rod.

 

[smokeysevin]

How the hell do you guys keep your floors so clean while doing this stuff?

Sean

 

[Chancegoodman]

How the hell do you guys keep your floors so clean while doing this stuff?

Sean

A broom

 

[Motiracer38]

Yeah I've been working on this for 5 months now so the garage needs a good cleaning once in awhile. I cut out all the rear crossmembers and cleaned up the frame rails this week so had to clean a few times extra well.

 

[Kellyex1450]

Your swift progress is inspiring! what's the secret to your motivation? my motivation has slowed with age and children. I need a good speed dealer or a testosterone boost (I suppose a garage would also help) . I just need to figure it out by Christmas when I finally dig into my project.

You have a target finish time frame or event you're trying to make with this?