school me on short course setups

[Epiccreation]

Got an f150, got a Blitzkreig long travel kit, no clue on what to do with the rear setup. Have two trucks in our group currently running a short course setup with king 3.0 ibp coilovers. They seem to work very good. Looking for opinions on a setup for the rear. My concern is a short course setup not being enough to keep up with the front. Talk to me about it.

 

[Giant Geoff]

The Short Course link is a more affordable way to get good suspension on your truck in an easier manner
Since it is straight tubing and not a structural lowered arm, it cuts the cost, but the shock needs to be mounted close to the axle where you get limited travel out of an 18” shock. I have a package deal with my Short Course, daily driver, link kit, and 3.0” x 24” travel IBP shocks with a combined cost of $5550.

 

[counterpart7]

@geoff’s setup looks like a good option!

I would definitely consider running a trailing arm similar to @marcytech old silverado or the gmc that @ChristianEwing built for Ehren. I believe both of them moved the shock about 12” forward of the axle. It will ride a lot less harsh and you’ll get a little more travel out of a “short course” setup. Both of those trucks work extremely well.

 

[Giant Geoff]

Giant also have a DDL & 4-link kits with the shocks halfway up the lower arm.

 

[Epiccreation]

@geoff’s setup looks like a good option!

I would definitely consider running a trailing arm similar to @marcytech old silverado or the gmc that @ChristianEwing built for Ehren. I believe both of them moved the shock about 12” forward of the axle. It will ride a lot less harsh and you’ll get a little more travel out of a “short course” setup. Both of those trucks work extremely well.

I already have a set of 3.0X18 bypasses for the rear is also part of my consideration. My thinking was it would be easier to just get a coilover vs selling me bypass shocks and buying an ibp coilover for the setup

 

[Giant Geoff]

We just did this truck where he already had a 18 inch shock and is getting 21 inches of travel. He’s very happy with it. Here is a side view of how my Mounts connect to the Axle,.

 

[Motiracer38]

It helps if you have a lot of weight to cut down on the harshness. Full cage, dual spares, crew cab, etc. Still much better than leaves, just not the floaty feel of a true trailing arm.

 

[ChristianEwing]

@geoff’s setup looks like a good option!

I would definitely consider running a trailing arm similar to @marcytech old silverado or the gmc that @ChristianEwing built for Ehren. I believe both of them moved the shock about 12” forward of the axle. It will ride a lot less harsh and you’ll get a little more travel out of a “short course” setup. Both of those trucks work extremely well.

Thanks for the recognition dude The formula ive gotten for a single shock rear link setup im very happy with. It takes more work than just bolting/welding on some brackets, but if you want a GOOD riding truck thats not going to beat you up like a traditional "short course" link truck does (I will never build a desert truck this way, ever) its the only way to go. I have another silverado thats on the books currently to get the new updated version of what Ehren received.

If OP, or anyone, wants the proper parts give me a shout

VDOffroad@gmail.com

 

[ChristianEwing]

And just to add to this, I do not recommend running an IBP coilover if you are planning on running a hydraulic bumpstop. I do not recommend running a bypass on anything other than a traditional trailing arm either. A 3.0 coilover and 2.5 bumpstop is all this package needs to work properly

 

[Kellyex1450]

I ran an 18" single-coilover rear 4-link setup back around 2004–2006, and honestly, it was a huge pain to tune. After a lot of trial and error with shock adjustments, it eventually worked, but it took forever. At one point Greg Gagnon tuned it for me, and I ran ROR a few times with it.


I’m sure tuning options are much better today—this style of setup is way more common now and the knowledge base has grown a ton—but I’d still have a hard time going back to something like that. Mine was on the back of a Ranger. We experimented with triple-rate springs, no rebound shims, flipping pistons, and more. I can’t even remember the final setup—it was just too sensitive to every little change.


Eventually I switched to a more traditional setup after riding in Mexi Mike’s truck in Barstow. Greg was tuning his as well, and the difference was night and day. With the shocks working against leverage, everything just felt better. I never looked back after that.


To be fair, the short-course setup did shine in ROR corners—it worked really well there. If I were to use an 18" coilover again, I’d put it on a little leverage, maybe around 80%, and call it good.

 

[DialedShockPrep]

Basically what everyone said above.
you NEED leverage on these shocks for them to work properly on a higher speed application and for spring rate purposes. Those two literally go hand in hand with eachother because the leverage allows you to run high enough spring rates to actually push the axle down to keep the tires planted between holes. Without the leverage you’ll end up with something like a 100/200lb spring rate which has an effective combined rate of 66lbs. On both MarcyTechs silverado and Chris’s F150 I had them build the lower links about with the shocks. About 12-14” up from the Heim. Reason for this is to slow down the shaft speeds enough so the tires can actually drop quickly, run heavier springs in the 200/300 range, and gain travel. I want to say both trucks were strapped right around 23” total travel with a bit more left in the shocks. Both of the trucks ran standard 3.0x18” coilovers and bump stops and worked very well. Knowing what i know now i would change up the shock setups pretty drastically but they both got down and would put a hurting on a lot of other linked trucks, and worked a helluva lot better than leafs would.

Key notes to take away from this
-Shocks need leverage. 12-14” up the lower from the Heim is the business
-You need preload aka spring pressure at droop to make it work right, so make sure you have rear weight
-c notch or kick the frame. All the bump travel you can get is ideal. 12” up from ride height minimum
-do not mount the shocks to the axle, it sucks unless you drive smooth roads or short courses only
-this setup parties.

 

[Epiccreation]

Basically what everyone said above.
you NEED leverage on these shocks for them to work properly on a higher speed application and for spring rate purposes. Those two literally go hand in hand with eachother because the leverage allows you to run high enough spring rates to actually push the axle down to keep the tires planted between holes. Without the leverage you’ll end up with something like a 100/200lb spring rate which has an effective combined rate of 66lbs. On both MarcyTechs silverado and Chris’s F150 I had them build the lower links about with the shocks. About 12-14” up from the Heim. Reason for this is to slow down the shaft speeds enough so the tires can actually drop quickly, run heavier springs in the 200/300 range, and gain travel. I want to say both trucks were strapped right around 23” total travel with a bit more left in the shocks. Both of the trucks ran standard 3.0x18” coilovers and bump stops and worked very well. Knowing what i know now i would change up the shock setups pretty drastically but they both got down and would put a hurting on a lot of other linked trucks, and worked a helluva lot better than leafs would.

Key notes to take away from this
-Shocks need leverage. 12-14” up the lower from the Heim is the business
-You need preload aka spring pressure at droop to make it work right, so make sure you have rear weight
-c notch or kick the frame. All the bump travel you can get is ideal. 12” up from ride height minimum
-do not mount the shocks to the axle, it sucks unless you drive smooth roads or short courses only
-this setup parties.

got any pictures of a good setup?

 

[the bodj]

Here's my setup. I forgot how far from the heim the shock is mounted, but I think 12ish" with a 14"x2.5" coilover, getting 21" of travel bumped and strapped with a 4"x2.0 bumpstop. I was worried about my spring rates being super light for all the reasons @DialedShockPrep mentioned, plus not wanting a big ride change if I load the truck down, so I built the rear frame rails out of 2x4x.250" tube, added the 31gallon tank behind the axle, spare behind the axle, and rooftop tent over it all. The truck is so comfortable and boogies faster than I'm comfortable with, especially now that I'm messing around with the crossover nut on the shock. I wish I sold the 14s and used 16s for a bit more droop, but it doesn't limit me much. Shocks at 90* at bump, and lower mounts a half inch below the link centerline are important, imo



Bump


Droop

 

[Turboyota]

When I read “short course link setup” I think shocks mounted to the axle housing, not anywhere on the links.

 

[Epiccreation]

When I read “short course link setup” I think shocks mounted to the axle housing, not anywhere on the links.

This was my thinking as well until people chimed in

 

[the bodj]

When I read “short course link setup” I think shocks mounted to the axle housing, not anywhere on the links.

Duh. We’re all talking him out of it

 

[Turboyota]

EpicC “I want to know about short course link setups”

Everyone except Geoff and Kelly: “here are pics and testaments about standard shock-on-link setups and how they are better”

 

[counterpart7]

EpicC “I want to know about short course link setups”

Everyone except Geoff and Kelly: “here are pics and testaments about standard shock-on-link setups and how they are better”

Lol. He asked for opinions on SC setups, said he didn’t know which direction he wanted to go, and said he was concerned the SC setup might not keep up with the front end… sounds like everyone did their best to steer him in the right direction

Also, most of the setups that have been mentioned would be considered “Short Course” these days. No, they aren’t the traditional short course setups from 2001, but they are commonly referred to as Short Course. And they work a fuck of a lot better than the pogo setups of yesteryear.

 

[the bodj]

EpicC “I want to know about short course link setups”

Everyone except Geoff and Kelly: “here are pics and testaments about standard shock-on-link setups and how they are better”

Don't you have a 5th motor to rebuild?

 

[Epiccreation]

EpicC “I want to know about short course link setups”

Everyone except Geoff and Kelly: “here are pics and testaments about standard shock-on-link setups and how they are better”

To be honest I was kind of always leaning towards a more traditional trailing arm type setup so I am glad the conversation is going the way it is lol